Dedicated Follower of Fashion

Now we go from the Who to one of my favorite underrated bands of all time. One of the most influential bands no one gives a shit about anymore, the Kinks. They were true punks 12 years before the Sex Pistols exploded on the English scene, yet beyond Lola, you don’t hear too much about them anymore.

Be that as it may, the 49ers have their own dedicated follower of fashion, and a new blogosphere topic sure to at least get close to the fun we used to have with Alex Smith, and that is one Colin Kaepernick and his impending contract upgrade.

The 2 main camps are; pay the man, or hedge the bet and wait a year. If necessary, franchise him.

Either side has it’s plusses and minusses. Frankly, my take is pay him now because his price will only go up in the front office drags their feet. This is hard to dispute since guys like Romo, Cutler, and Ryan have monster deals in place and they have done little to nothing in playoff games. Kaepernick on the other hand took over both Green Bay playoff wins, and willed the team back in the Atlanta game, and the Super Bowl after the defense laid a huge turd in the 1st half of both those games.

The only reason not to sign Kaepernick is to think he isn’t the quarterback of the future, and that he’ll somehow revert to Mark Sanchez and fail miserably. With the structure this team has in place (for now), a huge backslide like that is highly unlikely. I mean really, this isn’t Tannenbaun, Rex Ryan and the Jets. And if this comes down to franchising Kappy, that isn’t the trail to happiness. The Saints travelled this road with Brees, and ended up giving him the biggest contract in NFL history at the time. Not something the Niners want to do.

So, pay him $18 mill as a base and give him incentives to jack shit up if he wins it all.

The on;y wrench to be thrown into this is Kappy himself wanting to hold out and play out his deal in the hopes of winning it all and really forcing the issue (kinda like what Harbaugh is doing). That is a dangerous road for anyone, let alone your fearless scrambling quarterback.

Me? I’ll be lazing on this sunny afternoon.

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About unca_chuck

Lifelong SF 49ers and SF Giants fan
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107 Responses to Dedicated Follower of Fashion

  1. unca_chuck says:

    Got to love Dave Davie’s flying V.

    • 12th man says:

      Ah memories.

      I guess I have one foot in each camp about Kap. Would love to do a deal now and lock him up. He is a very good QB now and could be one of the greats but everything in life has a value and agreeing his based on what we see to date is a tricky one.

  2. NoFear49er says:

    Amazing how my position of letting CK7 play another year before committing to a huge, ‘forever’ contract goes from getting mocked relentlessly to a may be possible scenario with “plusses and minusses” in just a couple days.

    Always entertaining how so many of my positions go from mock and ridicule to being thrown back at me as someone else’s “I’ve been saying for a while now.” A player’s heartburn over being franchise-tagged comes to mind as another recent hit.

    Nothing wrong with changing one’s mind or opinion after knowing more than he thought he knew or due to changing and evolving circumstances, but after mocking someone’s differing opinion so loudly and emphatically it seems more than a bit outrageous that the mocker suddenly forgot whose opinion was whose.

    I predict we are slouching toward another “I told you so” moment either way.

    • Spitblood says:

      I haven’t changed my opinion regardless what the 49ers do. They should re-sign Kaep, or extend him, right now.

      • 12th man says:

        At any price Spit?

      • Spitblood says:

        Obviously not at any price, but I’d pay him 18. I know it’s reported he’s asking for more, but I think that’s because Harbaugh and Kaep are, to a certain degree, negotiating together. What I mean by that is that Kaep might not be signing until Harbaugh gets paid, like a good protege. Do Kaep and Harbaugh have the same agent?

  3. ewisco says:

    kaep sucks.

  4. What is Kap’s value to Niners? That be the question to answer. Another is ‘what is the market fer franchise QB who can win (some) in playoffs?’ Sure his agent + Kap have some ideas and a bottle of smelling salts fer Paraag. This is the Niner QB of the long term future looks exactly like.

    Whatever the #s are for CK it won’t be getting cheaper = salary cap is up up up and we know he plays well in big games. Pay the man sooner not later but like Jimi maybe he wants to drag it out to his advantage.

    Niners are playing the conventional bargaining game which is fine but the market is/has shifted this year for a comparable position on D = CB. GB signed Sam Shields $39 M / 4 years = $9M + per which is up from last years $5-6M per. Way up. So franchise QB handpicked by the HC won 4 playoff games with salary cap up $10M next couple years is going to get
    Cheaper?

    I’m in the pay ’em now camp.

    • 12th man says:

      It’s not that anyone thinks it gets cheaper to wait. Take a hypothetical, Kap says 20+ per and the Niners think 16 is fair so they defer the decision to next year and all things equal he has another outstanding year and it costs the team another 2 mil per year, bad decision?

      How about Kap has a terrible year, much like Rivers who fell off a cliff and everyone said he was done. In that scenario it cost the team 1 mil to understand he was not as good as they thought. Kap and his agent have to negotiate based on results and now he is a 12 mil guy, the team saved 10 mil per and are not locked into a massive overpay for 3/4 years.

      Those are the considerations the team have to have before handing out a multiple year top dollar contract. They can’t afford to make a mistake as it hamstrings the team for years.

      I don’t think Kap regresses but can’t see it worth betting 20 Mil x ? years to find out. He just hasn’t played enough games for me to feel comfortable. If it were my call I would do 16 mil, if they really push I add some incentive and I don’t do more than 3 real years without the ability to pull the plug at no cost.

      After another 16+ games this season and he again is still improving I write the man a check because he is known to be worth the asking price.

      • 12th man says:

        Just to be clear, if he agrees to 16 mil per year I would do that deal right now.

      • I say it will cost more because I don’t see Kap regressing unless we have a bunch of key injuries on O- like last year w/Crab. Or- God forbid- He gets injured. Kap in my view is nowhere near his ceiling and will continue to improve for foreseeable future. Even if Jimi leaves which is unlikely in next couple years Kap will improve = my assumption. So I see no way Niners win a waiting game. IMO.

        As long as he’s healthy, team improves w/ WRs and passing game then I really don’t care what the Niners and Kap do. Because our record will be very good.

      • NJ49er says:

        Phil running QBs are a heavy risk.
        He’s not a prolific QB in terms of his pocket presence yet.
        Those guys like Crabtree want their due too.

        Incentives, incentives, incentives…..

      • 12 as you may recall you and I both said “$16M/yr” but if the #s get up to what NJ & Chuck are saying = $18M+/yr then the only way I see Niners agreeing is if he will sign for 6-7 cap friendlier years. May not be likely either way this year = lower yearly amount OR longer deal. As you say may be too early fer either side to feel comfortable.

        As a team and as fans we just have no recent experience with a top paid QB- since Joe/Steve so this is unfamiliar territory for fans and more importantly for the FO. Same goes fer Hendrix = unfamiliar territory for any of us to be considering top 5 money given the sad sack coaching results around here for past 10-15 years.

        Don’t see either QB or HC going anywhere anytime soon, my impression.
        It’s all negotiating blather mainly around FO/Jedi/media vs Hendrix. May not be this year but believe HC & QB work it out and stick here for many years

      • 12th man says:

        Yes Phil I recall we agree on 16 and at that number we are on the same page, pay the man. 16 mil is by no stretch of the imagination a small contract, that’s double the Alex Smith number. But as NF pointed out before, there is a pecking order to this stuff and it’s like players get respect by the size of their contracts or something.

        The team is a larger concern and to tie up 16% or so of the entire cap to one player you better be damned sure he is worth it because he will have to be capable of making lesser players around him better. Suppose a 20 mil contract means Crabs can’t be signed, Kap has to be able to make a lesser talent viable, something Tom Brady has done for years. I don’t see that in Kap right now.

        I don’t blame Kap for one second trying to maximize his contract but if the reports are correct then he is likely looking at signing that contract next year.

  5. NJ49er says:

    As with any hypothetical negotiation we conduct here, it’s about varied viewpoints.
    All good to hear these opinions.

    I’ll hold onto the belief that Kaep is a keeper.
    I’d also think along the lines of the Cutler contract as a good place to structure it.
    Cutler hasn’t done squat, but, the deal is Cap friendly.
    Paraag is a pretty sharp dude in terms of deals he’s structured in the recent past.

    No deal gets done unless both sides see value.
    I’ve always believed in incentive clauses in anything business related.
    Balances the void between the opposing sides of the table.

    Hit Kaep heavy with up-front coin.
    Backload the Contract on a longer term deal with Cap friendly impact through the next several years.
    I’m still happy to go 8 years with him, simply because he’s young.

    You then use guys like Brees and Flacco, as reasons why it’s necessary to structure QB deals in such a way that, it doesn’t erode the Teams around them.

    • 12th man says:

      Can’t see him doing 8 NJ, he will want multiple contracts inside his playing career and he is 27 this year. We both know an 8 year contract is in reality a 5 but still, in order to get 3 contracts they need to be 4 year deals and he already has played 3. Agree with the Cutler contract, money up front, cap friendly and only 3 years locked in.

      • NJ49er says:

        8 could also come in the way of option years too 12th.
        It’s all about the structure for me.
        Numbers are numbers.
        Half of those numbers are fluff anyway.

        There’s plenty of ways to do it.
        I’m sure it will get hammered out amicably, assuming Kaep wants to play in SF long-term.

      • 12th man says:

        NJ, it’s all about the signing bonuses. That’s the big chunk cash for signing a new contract or a majorly revised contract. The yearly salary, whilst hardly chump change is far less. That’s why he needs 3 bites at the cherry to make his dough and even then he will be hard pressed to make Rothlisberger money. That sucker has banked over 70 mil and counting, most in league history and he has done it in 10 years, was he worth it? I guess he did win a couple of SB so maybe he was but he sure as shit won’t win another one so now he is on the deficit side of the ledger and the team needs to groom a new young gun.

      • NJ49er says:

        I hear you 12th.
        All in the language of the deal.
        One thing I’ve appreciated with Paraag and Baalke has been their value system.
        Granted, Alex was pre Rookie Cap but, they’ve managed to revise his deals along the way to keep things in order.
        Kaep is their first swing at a QB Contact post Rookie Cap too.

        It’s always about expectations and reality with these deals.
        Hoping for a good faith effort that works for both sides.

    • Can’t argue with this NJ

    • NJ49er says:

      Baalke and Marathe seem to have a pretty good business model devised between them.
      Plenty of Draft Picks means room to swing and miss on development too.
      We aren’t looking for immediate impact guys either.

      When you can make a play for a guy like Reid, you ante up and make the play.
      Good management practices there.

      Can’t make a deal? Your guy is gone when you’re on the clock?
      Deal back, grab coin for another swing later.
      Can’t do the RG III thing unless you’re absolutely convinced your guy is THE GUY.
      Then, as DC did, you handcuff your future when the other holes can’t be filled because you’ve lost those Picks.

    • NJ49er says:

      And, if Baalke goes out and Drafts another QB in May, which I fully expect him to do, you have the added influence of competition behind the scenes.
      The ugly side of business.
      Have to be prepared for the unexpected.

  6. NoFear49er says:

    NJ49er,

    Which key guys are you giving up to pay all that up front money to CK7?

    How can you be heavy up-front with a back-loaded contract? If you mean to pay down the amount of signing bonus to reduce the amount spread over the contract life, is that smart with so many free agents to re-sign?

    If CK7 improves to the point you’d expect if you’d paid him his $20M for five years, you can pay him next year, and even at a higher price you’re taking less of a risk on your #1 player. The only downside I see is if we were to get in trouble cap and/or cash-wise to the point of not being able to put together a reasonable offer.

    For Phil, et al, it’s easy enough to say you believe in Kaepernick and that he should/will improve but it doesn’t cost you anything. What if your job and career were on the line with that decision? And make no mistake, being on the wrong end of a franchise quarterback deal gone bad is a sure ticket down the road.

    • NJ49er says:

      Hey NoFear49er, I’m not in the $20M range for starters.
      Simply a suggestion that, whatever number they arrive at, it should be Cap friendly.
      For those very reasons you suggest, other guys need to be paid.
      Crabtree especially should be a linchpin with Kaep.

      I’m all for hanging onto Kaep but, he can’t break up the Team chemistry in the process.

      Kaep, like Harbaugh, has benefitted from a solid roster.
      No way I mortgage the future without a larger concession from the Kaep Contract in terms of guaranteed money.

      Backload it.
      Keep it Cap friendly for the next several years until we see whether he’s another Sanchez or, the next coming of Brady.

      Incentives, incentives, incentives…..Good for business.

      • 12th man says:

        The Cutler contract is actually front loaded but spread over 3 years. His 7 year 126.7 mil contract is actually 3 years for 54 Mil guaranteed. The remaining 4 years and money are strictly team option years. He got no signing bonus at all.

      • NJ49er says:

        I think it’s a good basis on which to model something for Kaep 12th.
        In the end, it has to make sense for both sides.
        I’m hopeful Kaep wants to be here as much as we’d like to see him here.

        Going the way of Jerruh, restructuring PRomo just to find money for other players is ludicrous.
        All he’s doing is kicking the can down the road, all the while, he’s simply trying to convince himself he’s got a plan.

        Stupid is, as stupid does, in terms of QB Contracts.
        Gotta be smart, especially with the most expensive position on the Roster.

      • NoFear49er says:

        Didn’t Chicago also give up two firsts plus other picks and a QB to boot? Cutler’s another who showed like he was going to be pretty good in Denver but in Chicago, after all that money and picks half the QBs in the league could have played as well.

        Teams are willing to gamble like that because every team needs a big-time QB to take advantage of all the anti-defense passing rules. We are lucky that our team isn’t built quite as dependent on a Peyton Manning type that we have to gamble or else. We know we can win with a new guy at QB or an Alex Smith game-manager type. I appreciate we want to up our game but I wouldn’t mortgage everything else in the way Chicago did to do it.

      • 12th man says:

        I read somewhere Jones the GM was 20 mil over the cap before making moves. Crazy.

      • NJ49er says:

        NoFear49er –
        Baalke managed to parlay the Alex deal into 2 Picks for us.
        Again, another smart business decision IMO.

        I don’t see Paraag and Baalke getting too far off their principles here.
        Like you, I value a solid team, not a lopsided ledger.

      • NJ49er says:

        That’s Jerruh 12th.
        Short on talent, long on ego.
        He and Snyder were also 2 owners that got their pee-pees whacked for Cap violations in the un-capped year.
        This game is not about handing out fat Contracts as commissions.
        Have to be smart about talent evaluation and keeping a team together.

    • NF asks: “… it’s easy enough to say you believe in Kaepernick and that he should/will improve but it doesn’t cost you anything. What if your job and career were on the line with that decision?”

      Then I might do what I said I think the Niners are likely to do above: wait until they have more evidence if they are not convinced he can do what he has already done = win in playoffs. But it’s always going to be a risk esp in this sport for ‘unexpected’ injuries. As Chuck said “Hell it’s not my money” and that goes for the rest of us. It’s easier to spend other peoples money.

  7. NJ49er says:

    Hey Spit –
    I noticed from a past thread or 2 that I was able to sell you on Ace Sanders last year.

    How come I can’t get you onboard for Dri Archer this year?
    Dri might be a better A$$ Rocket then Ace?

    Similar guys in size – Dri 5’7″ 173lbs – Ace 5’7″ 178
    Dri being a RB, Ace being a WR, might actually be a bigger benefit for us, in terms of a PR/KR option too?

    Not to mention Dri smoked the 40 (4.26) this year in Indy – Ace turned in a 4.53 at this Pro Day last year.

    Two-tenths of a second. That’s all that separated Archer from tying Tennessee Titans running back Chris Johnson’s combine record in the 40-yard dash. Archer, a 5-foot-8 runner who scored 11 touchdowns as a junior, posted the best 40 time in the 2014 combine with a time of 4.26. While everyone clamors over these results, Archer gave writers, NFL personnel and fans at home something to remember with an impressive time. Archer was among the top performers of all running backs in four combine categories: 40-yard dash, vertical jump (38 inches), three-cone drill (6.86 seconds) and 20-yard shuttle (4.06 seconds).

    Ace was a 4th RD Pick last year.
    I’d be happy to find Dri there.
    Can’t go wrong with a versatile guy like him IMO.

    • unca_chuck says:

      It’s the usage factor I worry about. I wonder if there’s going to be a fundamental change in the run game to better use guys like LMJ. Cuz the way we run now isn’t using him right.

  8. Nipper says:

    Sure a lot of angst on this blog. I’m not worried. After the Singletary, Nolan years this stuff is a piece of cake.

  9. unca_chuck says:

    Are you always so whiny, NoFear? I’m writing this as a point/counterpoint. I think it is pretty stupid to wait. I could say waiting is fucking stupid, but I’m not going to phrase it like that, If you hate everything I wrote why bother?

    My position has been pretty clear, but you think I’m silently hoping for a gotcha moment? Go piss up a rope. It’s so funny that you have so m any problems with everything I post. Much like someone else somewhere else.

    I disagree with plenty of people here and other places, but you and Bullit are the only ones who get personal offended. Why is that?

    Have a nice day.

  10. NoFear49er says:

    Why is that? It’s a pretty simple dynamic, really. Treat people with respect and they’re more likely to respond respectfully. Attack people’s dissenting opinions with vitriolic criticism and personal invective and you’re likely to invite the same in their response to you.

    Chuck: We should pay Kaep now!

    PosterX: I think we should wait to see more first.

    Chuck: Are you stupid? Have you ever watched a football game? You’d have to be a moron to think we should wait. I’m right and you’re stupid.

    PosterX: Well, fvck you.

    Chuck: Why are you such a mean guy and stalking my posts?

    Chuck: Oh, yeah, you’re an asshole, too.

    Chuck: Why does everyone like me but you?

    Chuck: You’re a crybaby. I’m cool. Ask anybody.

    Have a delusional day.

  11. NJ49er says:

    Hey 12th, great news in Dallas, Jerruh has $2M in Cap space.
    Let the parade begin.

    I think he should cut the entire Team and start over.
    Except for PRomo of course.
    He so wants to look like the Chief Executive there too.
    Everything under control, no stones left unturned, humming right along, firing on all cylinders.

    All he needs is the big red nose and clown shoes to complete the ensemble.

    PFT suggests he could really make a splash by parting with Demarcus Ware.
    They’re right.
    But hey, family is family in Dallas.
    Drafting his replacement would involve some skill.
    Restructure.
    Kick that can a little further down the road Jerruh.

    • NJ49er says:

      Odds on Jerruh Drafting Jackson Jeffcoat anyone?
      I’m going with Slam-Dunk.
      Probably will reach a little for him too.

      Legacy Pick.
      Family thing, like a Company picnic.

    • 12th man says:

      2 mil under? Well that takes care of his lunch tab lol. He has to be still sharpening his axe, he needs a couple of mil just to sign his daft (draft) picks.

  12. Spitblood says:

    Trent Baalke and Paraage just flat-out suck at their jobs if Frank Gore makes 6 million in 2014.

    • NJ49er says:

      Always possible to restructure but, that invites Cap implications beyond this year too.

      http://www.csnbayarea.com/49ers/rogers-gore-contracts-under-scrutiny

    • Sentiment may get in the way with Frank if we pay him $6 M this year. If he won’t restructure they should cut him I’m thinking. Too bad he’s been great but it’s a business. Read that article NJ but what cap implications are you referring to? Signing other guys? We have a bunch. Maiocco mentions this means Niners are going to have a little chat w/ FG. Meat axe Matt doing the dirty work fer Jedi, TB, PM

      • NJ49er says:

        I don’t see them playing any hardball with Frank at this point Phil.
        All that would factor in for me at this point is, the age/salary factor being the obvious reason you bring these guys up.

        Rogers is the key Contract for me.
        Frank, not so much.
        We don’t know what to expect from Lattimore until he takes some hits either.

  13. unca_chuck says:

    Yeah, I’m with NJ. Rogers is the sticking point. He’s fallen off the table. Rogers should just be cut. He’s barely a nickel back at this point. Gore is still semi-viable. Plus you have the loyalty and PR factor. They ain’t going to mess with Gore unless he’s amenable to restructuring. Cutting a guy 33 yards before 10,000 would not be looked at kindly. He’s paid his dues multiple times over.

    I’ve tried that with you, NoFear but you always freak out and then disappear. You are the one to come unrailed at the drop of a hat. Much like Buwwitt. But whatever. Press on, skippy. I mean really. Try talking politics without losing your mind or perspective.

  14. unca_chuck says:

    In other words, they should keep Whitner and dump Rogers. They shouldn’t be fishing for a safety and a CB in the draft.

    • Jets like Whitner so it’s gonna cost a bundle now to keep him. Also Brown is going to get a big payday if Shields $39M/4yr deal with GB is an indication

      • NJ49er says:

        Yeh Phil, once again, a team like GB sets the bar for a mediocre talent like Shields.
        All good if you’re a player of course.

        Indy has coin to spend.
        Verner to Indy?
        Jairus Byrd?

        As was the case with Goldson. Someone will pony up.
        Payday is why many guys play.
        We’re now on the flip-side.
        Guys may take less, to have the shot at the hardware.

        Cyclical this game of FA.
        Where once we had to overpay for talent, patience is the Flavor of the Month.
        Draft Picks are the life-blood of the future.

  15. Spitblood says:

    If Frank Gore makes 6 million going into 2014, that will tell you alone just how competent Trent and Paraage are. If they can’t restructure or flat out cut Frank, they are too emotionally attached to a player and that can’t happen. Don’t let NJ muddy the water with talk of Carlos. Two seperate issues. Just because CSN Bay Area lumped ’em together doesn’t mean the rest of the Baalke apologists will get away with it. If Baalke and Paraage pay Gore 6 million in 2014, they have to go.

    • unca_chuck says:

      Bullshit. I’d think Frank will rework his deal, but he isn’t a huge problem. Rogers is a much bigger cap hit for what he provides. I ain’t lumping them together, but we have little at safety right now. And corner is thin at best.

  16. Spitblood says:

    And one more thing about Baalke’s incompetence. We all know he can’t draft a receiver. If he tries to address this in free agency with the likes of Hakeem Nicks (because he has not clue how to evaluate a receiver coming out of college) we should actually string Baalke up. AJ Jenkins over Alshon Jeffrey? You call that a talent evaluator? I could do better.

    • NJ49er says:

      Nicks mailed it in in a Contract year Spit.
      Gotta question his heart.

      We’ll see where Alshon rates over time.
      Water over the dam at this point.
      WRs are a tough ticket from College to Pros.
      Few are slam dunks.

      As for Frank, his final go around isn’t a bank-breaker, as the Cap increased by $10M.
      I’m not muddying any water, it’s the nature of the game.
      Age and Contracts catch up with everyone.
      If Baalke and Marathe didn’t plan ahead properly, we’d be Dallas or NO, throwing Contracts overboard to keep themselves afloat.

      Frank is more of a SF fixture than Rogers.
      Give him his due, unless of course you want him around another year, which I know you don’t.

      • NJ49er says:

        Yhey can also figure that Frank carries some Goodwill along with his Contract figure.
        Moreso then a guy like CJ in TN, who carries an $8M price tag and a me-first attitude.
        There are differences between over-priced RBs and over-valued talent.
        We’re not poorly managed, like so many other franchises are, at this time of year.

      • NJ49er says:

        You pay guys like Anquan because of intangibles as well.
        Role models, locker room Vets who do it the right way, for the right reasons.
        Age and Contract numbers are speculative ventures.

        Give me guys like Frank and Anquan anyday, because they play for the love of competition.
        Winners at every step of the process, from the off-season through the grind of Camps.
        These guys give it and, leave it on the Field.

        It’s a respect thing.
        They’ve earned that.

  17. I can see the goodwill factor with Frank Gore but is the cap hit between him and Rogers that big? They are both scheduled to make $6M + this year. If it’s a choice between FG and Rogers we keep Frank for sentimental reasons or do we need the RB more than the CB? Both areas seem thin.

    It’s clear Balky is only a front man for Jeddie in the FO hierarchy = no GM operates independently of the President/Owner so JY is pulling the strings w/FO input- clearly. Spit, 12 have pointed this out re: media attacks on HC, supposed rift w/TB, etc. Yeah it’s Jedi no doubt. I don’t have many issues w/ Balkys GM work or FO generally = cap okay compared to the hell we were in prior to Paraages arrival, player acquisition okay apart from ’12 draft- wrs excepted- good stockpiling of draft picks, etc. Maybe we can hold off drafting injured O players fer awhile: Lattimore, Looney, Bykowski in last 2 drafts

    • NJ49er says:

      Personally Phil I don’t Jed has a clue about the talent aspect of the team.
      He’s got Paraag and Trent in place for that.
      Harbaugh is more of the Jed area IMO.
      Even there, Baalke was the guy that made that hire, no doubt with Jed’s blessing as Jed has to sign the checks.

      Grabbing injured guys is also a value-based move.
      Guys you didn’t necessarily need right away, productive in College, devalued at Draft time because of injuries.

      Gamble? Sure.
      It’s always a crap-shoot between College and Pros.

      All the guys like Lattimore, Tank and Dial were bargains where Baalke chose them.
      Each guy got the chance to red-shirt, rehab and, get acquainted with the process.
      I firmly believe that good organizations survive with the balance of Cap Mgt and Draft success.
      Nobody can afford to live in FA forever.
      Rookie Cap is the new order of the NFL.
      Bring in all the guys you can get.
      Evaluate and seek the keepers, when the time is right, to offer them extensions.

      7th RD Picks and UDFAs are no longer throw away Picks.
      If you can identify a project guy who deserves a shot, why not?
      Cheap enough to gamble on those guys.
      Never know what might turn up after a year or 2 of development.
      Look at TBrock.
      he might have stolen the job from TBrown and, saved a good chunk of Cap money in the process.

  18. Spitblood says:

    Frank Gore and Carlos Rogers are two separate players. Are they a package deal? No. Let’s just focus on Frank Gore. He’s not worth 2 million a year despite Baalke trying to sell him to 49er fans.

    • NJ49er says:

      Spit there’s guys that want it, there’s guy that expect it.
      Frank is a guy that deserves it.
      He’s been the heart and soul of this Offense for years.

      Carlos?
      Dispensable.

      Baalke isn’t trying to sell Frank to anyone.
      Frank did that on his own.
      Baalke is rewarding him for what he’s already accomplished.

      • Spitblood says:

      • NJ49er says:

        I’d choose to shoot guys like Brandon Jacobs Spit.
        He felt he deserved it too.
        For what?
        I’m not really sure.

        Shoot Frank, not so much.
        He’s earned it.

      • Spitblood says:

        Foolish. You don’t spend emotional money anywhere, and that’s what you’re advocating. His worth is less than 3 million per year, and that’s what you pay him. If he doesn’t like it, let him walk. This is how you run a front office. If you’re emotionally attached, you don’t belong making decisions.

      • NJ49er says:

        It’s not an emotional call for me Spit.
        It’s a football player contributing to the team.
        Sure, he’s on the short side of his production now but, he’s also a mentor to guys like Lattimore and anyone coming in from the Draft in May.
        It’s a small price to pay IMO.
        Few guys have laced them up and given the game everything he has.
        Be nice for him to take a Ring with him before he hangs them up.

      • NJ49er says:

        When you see Baalke cut ties with a guy like AJJ, you can pretty much assume he’s not an emotional guy.
        Nor is he full of himself in terms of ego.
        It’s a business decision.
        See a mistake, get it corrected.

        I hardly think he’s an emotional sort when his job is to provide talent.
        We’ve seen plenty of Dana Hall, Rashaun Woods, Kentwan Balmer-types before him too.
        It’s football.
        Not every Draft Pick makes an impact.
        Some guys step it up, others’ never figure it out.

      • NJ49er says:

        Israel Ifeany,i Jim Druckenmiller ring any bells?
        Gio Carmazzi instead of Tom Brady?
        Think Bill would do that over in hindsight?
        Happens to the best of them in this racket.

        I hear Gio is one heckuva yoga instructor / goat farmer though.

  19. Hope is coaches give him a lot more rest this season which being in love w/Gore they haven’t done since they got here. No wonder our O looks the same = coaches fall in love w/Frank. He’s wearing down so hopefully Lattimore, Hunter, LMJ +?? can take up the slack. And coaches junk their other infatuation with Jumbo and run outside, HB catches/screens more, please

    • NJ49er says:

      I’ve seen some suggestions that we’re looking to open things up some more in ’14?
      We’ll see.
      Frank has been the answer for years.
      Time to add some new options for sure Phil.

      • NJ49er says:

        I’d hope and expect that this Draft Class will provide some speed on the outside too.
        Plenty of options at WR.
        Question remains as to whether someone they add can get into the mix quickly.

  20. unca_chuck says:

    Rogers is an $8 million cap hit. He’s barely a nickel back Frank has something left. End of story.

    Frank isn’t the problem. As far as Baalke goes, it’s easy to dog him for AJJ and LMJ and Hunter, but he has hit some strong drafts as well. Going after injured guys is a risk, but Gore worked out. We’ll see about our latest batch of dinged up draft choices. They all could end up being big value picks. Lattimore is the one who stands to make the biggest impact. Tank and Dial need to get in the rotation this year as well as J Smith is getting close to the end and we need some help there.

    York is not part of the brain trust as far as draft decisions go. He should be like Eddie and hand out the towels after the game.

    • Spitblood says:

      Frank is the problem on offense. No question.

    • NJ49er says:

      Jed is doing what Jerruh never learned to do Chuck.
      Let football people handle the football team.

      Paraag may be the Cap Whiz Kid but, as far as I’m concerned, he’s earning his keep.
      After watching guys like Tannenbaum and others screw things up with Cap mayhem, we really don’t have a lot to complain about in SF.

  21. unca_chuck says:

    Jim Brown couldn’t run up the middle against the defenses Frank usually faces. That’s a scheme problem. They are going to wean Frank out as Lattimore gets more touches anyway. Not sure why he’s such a big issue, Spitty.

    No, I’m with you on the front office, NJ. They have been doing a much better job since Harbaugh came around, and even beforehand. Although it was hard to tell at times. They have done a very good job of keeping who they feel they need and locking them in to long term deals. Whitner’s getting courted hard by the Jets, but Donte has to know he doesn’t want to walk into that nightmare. Goldson took the money and ran into a buzzsaw of shittiness.

    • NJ49er says:

      Whitner is looking for his respect as well Chuck.
      It’s business after all.
      He’s come close with SF.
      If the offers are fair, he’d have to appreciate the shot at another run.
      But, in the end, he has a life to plan for after football.
      Money is important to any player in this game.
      I’d like Whitner to stick it out but, we don’t know what the deal is on the SF table, if there is one or not?

      I’m seeing Deone Bucannon coming our way in May.
      Several young SSs could be had on the cheap.
      Maybe RD 2 or 3?

      Have to prepare for the youth movement and getting Kaep paid too.

  22. unca_chuck says:

    Just think it’s a little iffy going into the season with one solid CB in Brock and Reid as the vet safety. Culliver’s coming off the IR, and a whole lot of questions in Wright (gone) Cox, and they may or may not sign Brown. Rogers isn’t staying, and Dahl isn’t much of an option.

    • NJ49er says:

      Ever evolving process Chuck.
      Have to get younger, all the while remaining consistant with the fundamental practices.
      Quite the juggling act.

      We’ll see what shakes out.
      They’ve held it together pretty well since Baalke and Harbaugh have paired up.
      As with Goldson, things change, the Cap still has to be maintained.
      Good Coaching comes into play, as much as the Vets have to yield to the youth factors.

  23. Spitblood says:

    Chuck: It’s an issue because it’s not only a bad plan, but the reluctance to dump an old player indicates the offense is too complex to interchange players, thus making the offense to dependent on specific players. And this is a core problem with the offense, and we’ve seen the issue repeatedly. You need to be able to plug in players faster into the offense to fool defenses, but if the offense is too complex, you can’t.

    In addition, Lattimore is no guarantee. The off season is just beginning. But if the 49ers stick with Gore and his 6 million in the 2014 season, and only have Lattimore as his backup, this front office is flat-out stupid.

    • NJ49er says:

      Same can be said for the Coaching too Spit.
      If Baalke is giving Harbaugh the control of the Roster, it can’t always be focused on the FO.
      Both sides have to work to accomplish a successful finished product.

      I’d suggest that Harbaugh and Roman have to adjust that dynamic.

    • NJ49er says:

      I’m still in favor of a more WCO oriented attack.
      This Draft should have plenty of options to improve the WR speed dynamic.
      How quickly they can be implemented is the key.

    • unca_chuck says:

      It’s the fact we don’t run outside the tackles. No sweeps or pitches, other than WR sweeps or the occasional reverse. You can’t run those in the heavy packages. It’s not the complexity, it’s that guys like LMJ aren’t build to run in the offense the way it’s built. The offense needs to change to get these others more involved.

  24. unca_chuck says:

    Hunter, and especially LMJ are built to get the ball in space. Not busting through the line like they’ve tried with Gore since 2005. Do we throw screens? Do we pitch the ball wide? No. It’s not in the game plan. Either they make it part of the game plan to utilize what LMJ and Hunter can bring, or they stick with Gore/Lattimore and keep banging away at the line

    • NJ49er says:

      Back to that recent debate about the Harbaugh/Baalke relationship.
      Is it the personnel or the Plan?
      What exactly are they seeing as the Offensive Plan going forward?

      Baalke isn’t calling plays.
      Something has to get figured out.

      • unca_chuck says:

        Yup. Curious shit heading to this draft. If they go defense, I feel that they are going to stay the course. I think they need more team speed. Especially at WR. Pretty much a no brainer to me. RBs? Sure. Later. They need, in order, a WR a CB, a SS if Whitner goes, QB, another WR, RB, CB/KR, DL, LB.

  25. NoFear49er says:

    Just to make sure I have this right, we want to pay CK7 $20 million a year and the sooner the better and we don’t want to pay the guy who ends up shouldering the load of the offense every year no matter what plan in the off-season falls apart in the pre-season and ends up at Frank Gore in the regular season year after playoff year. Is that about it?

    Some assume Hunter and LMJ don’t play more because Harbaugh and/or Roman have some strange tie to Frank Gore? How’d that tie and a mountain of accolades work out for Alex Smith?

    Every game and every practice each player is graded on his performance, how well he did what he was asked to do and how well he handled those unexpected situations with football smarts and situational awareness.

    Frank Gore’s grading sheets are full of pluses, LMJ and Hunter maybe not so much. Frank isn’t who is keeping the passing attack down, it’s the passing game that keeps Frank hitting those stacked fronts.

    Not sure why fans don’t see how easy our passing game is shut down, especially in the red zone. Don’t tell me we don’t have anybody getting open because CK7 is not looking anyway. It’s fine to get CK7 more weapons but good receivers get tired of downfield blocking and running go routes all game without getting so much as a look.

    • NJ49er says:

      Definitely a curious entity NoFear49er huh?
      This is solely a challenge to the Offensive Plan IMO.
      Frank has earned his right to get paid this year too.
      Paid his dues as it were.

      Until Roman/Harbaugh devise some sort of a timing Offense around Kaep, we’ll be facing the same challenges of radar lock on the Primary target and scramble.
      Or, Jumbo mania with a sprinkling of Lattimore.

  26. Spitblood says:

    That’s what I’ve been saying for a while now, Chuck. The 49ers’ run game now sucks. You know what’s coming from who’s in the backfield. If it’s Gore, it’s gotta be up the middle. If it’s Hunter or LMJ, it’s going to the outside. You can’t have two separate running styles with two separate backs or the defense knows what’s coming. You have to have one back who can run inside and run outside. Gore can no longer run outside. And if he’s your bell cow, you’re in trouble. Period. And that’s what happened in the Seattle game. The defense knew what Frank does and it was easy for them to take it away.

    Lattimore would be great if he could do both (run inside and out), and if the 49ers just go with Lattimore, I’m going to be double-crossing my fingers he doesn’t get injured again because then, if he does get injured, the 49ers, in my mind, are no longer serious contenders for a Super Bowl. Gore’s a non factor because he’s so limited. And you don’t play any limited player 6 million per year. I don’t care how great he’s been for us.

    The X factor is Hunter, who I think can do both, but the 49ers didn’t use him that way in 2013.

    • I looked at his highlights and you’re right- he runs upright, has long legs, long torso. At least he can cut and isn’t afraid to hit the hole either. Injury history is a worry

  27. This article does not mention the cap hit for the proposed 2yr/$14-15M per for Kap this year. Maybe this is more likely this year? It seems preferable to work out a long term deal, cap friendly but is it too soon?

    http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2014/03/09/the-triple-option-on-colin-kaepernicks-contract/

  28. unca_chuck says:

    Gore had some big games against shitty teams, but again, I don’t really have a problem with him. Just the scheme.

    Scheme scheme scheme. It took 17 games before we threw out of a bunched formation in the red zone. It took 17 games to run in a spread formation in the red zone. Both plays resulted in touchdowns. Otherwise it was run out of the jumbo, pass out of the 3 WR set.

    • Spitblood says:

      We’ve already talked about the cart before the horse being Roman or Gore. I say if you dump Gore the scheme gets better. Limited players create limited schemes. It’s that simple. And to make the scheme even more limited we lost Crabtree and Patton for a large part of the year.

    • phil fan says:

      17 games Then we break our tendencies? And it works twice fer TDs? Great, that means we only have to play 15 more to see it again, right?

      • NoFear49er says:

        Except it’s bullshit. Wk5 INC to Boldin. Wk6 TD to DAVIS. Wk6 28 yds to Davis. Wk14 INC to Miller. Wk 16 Sack. And that’s just a quick look see.

      • Please it’s not bullshit it’s Hyperbole = hype. You know exaggerating to make a point? As you mention in yer examples we have some success when we break our robotic tendencies

  29. unca_chuck says:

    I don’t think Kappy signs a 2 year deal. The shortest would be a bridge contract like Rodgers signed a few years ago. 4 years.

    • Spitblood says:

      If I’m Kaep, I want a short deal – two years. If I’m the 49ers, I want a six year deal. Chuck’s probably right that Kaep will sign a deal for 4 years.

    • Well the article is by Kevin Lynch @ the Chron and he’s a likely tool in the CSN playbook. Then too he’s not a very penetrating analyst of the game of football. Hell, Spitblood is better than Lynch.

  30. Spitblood says:

    Right now, a lot of fans are being critical of the deals that Flacco, Brees and Romo have received because the qb making more takes so much from the rest of the team. But when the cap expands, and teams have locked up their qbs for a long time, with some contracts getting cheaper over time, if the qb can stay healthy and dominant, that team then can make a few serious runs at the playoffs. The question is 1.) whether the qb will still be good when the cap increases and the contract decreases, and 2.) whether or not the GM can then have a team in place when the qb’s contract is more manageable for legitimate Super Bowl runs.

    I don’t know the structure of the before-mentioned qbs. Brees is obviously getting older. Flacco is still young. Romo will always be a choke artist. But Kaep could get a long-term deal with more money than we’ve expected with the 49ers thinking they’ll make another three year run two years down the road. The interesting aspect is how good the team will be regarding win / loss records and how that affects draft position.

    • NJ49er says:

      Which is the juggling act the GM is saddled with.
      Letting guys like Goldson get paid elsewhere while backfilling with Rookie deals if possible.

      Frank has to overlap his successor, which may or may not be Lattimore.
      I’m with you on grabbing another option however.
      If it’s not Lattimore, Hunter or James, maybe Jewel has some value?

      Rookies are expendible.
      Keep stockpiling them until the right guys are identified and retained.

      More Picks, more options, better odds of finding paydirt.

      We can afford the occassional Boldin, Moss, Rogers signings as fill-in/mentor value guys.
      You always want Picks.

    • NJ49er says:

      The whole Cap premise was devised to stop guys like Eddie from buying all the talent.

      The game is now won by running your opponents into the ceiling while building your foundation with Rookie options then, trying to retain them.
      Reason 1 why Jerruh is where he is, mired in mediocrity.
      Miss on a few Drafts or, deal away Picks for quick fixes and, you’re effed.

      Next step, stagger the deals so you have the money budgeted for the future needs.
      Which is why Kaep may create problems for guys like Iupati or Crabtree.
      Time will tell.
      QB wins in any argument unless he overplays his hand.

      • 12th man says:

        NJ, Baalke has done a good job of staggering deals IMO. One problem comes when you have a good draft and 2 or 3 come due at the same time. One of the reasons to try to do a deal with Kap this year is to try to stagger the other big FA due next year and with the probability of a few mil more cap room it is still possible.

        I think the Niners take 2 WR in this draft with an eye to losing Crabs next year. Iupati is presumed to be asking for tackle money. Aldon probably gets his option 5th year picked up by the team unless they are convinced he is playing with a full deck after this season.

        His contract will be sizeable if he can keep it together and maintain his on field productivity.

  31. Nipper says:

    In conclusion: stay away from mirrors …..with all the worry bags are sure to appear under the eyes. BLEEP!

  32. unca_chuck says:

    Yeah, even Lemonier plays his part in this. If he comes on like gangbusters, they have a leg to stand on dealing with Aldon Smith. To the point of trading him/letting him go. Same with Crabs. They get a WR who is above-grade, they can afford to let Crabs skate. The one guy who is fairly indispensable is Kappy.

    The front office has always been about getting imporftant guys to commit early to lessen the cap hit, and to lock down some of their strongest years. I don’t see this phoilosophy changing with Kaepernick.

    So, NoFear, you think our red zone offense is effective? Even you have to admit there are problems with it. Do you think telegraphing plays down close is a good strategy?

  33. unca_chuck says:

    New thread is up . . .

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